You already know the feeling. Your daughter might be on her phone right now more than she's off of it, and you're not really sure exactly what's happening or what she's doing on there, the group chats, the DMs, the apps, all the things. And after 14 years of coaching girl athletes, I'll tell you this: the trust you're trying to build in the car ride home with her after a game is the same one that keeps her safe online. It's actually not two separate problems. It's one relationship growing in two separate places. And today's guest on the podcast is Farida. She's an award-winning Forbes 30 Under 30 internet safety expert and the founder of Protect Kids Online. She was groomed online as a teenager, and that experience became her mission. She has spent years helping parents protect their kids from online predators, scams, cyberbullying, and now digital threats powered by AI. She's partnered with NASA, Meta, FedEx, Mozilla, Verizon, and she's been featured everywhere from CNN to Forbes. So in this episode, we're talking about how to actually see what's happening in your daughter's digital world without it turning into this battle or something that she hides from you. So this was an extremely insightful episode for me as a parent as well. I know that you're going to listen and enjoy and take away a lot from this conversation with Farida. Welcome, Farida, to the podcast. I'm so excited that you're here. Can you first tell our audience a little bit about who you are and what you do? My name is Farida Shaheed, and online I go by CyberFarida. I have a background in cybersecurity awareness and threat intelligence, and I grew up in the digital age, so I experienced online grooming and exploitation and abuse as a child. I didn't understand that that was what it was until I grew older and understood terms and was able to unpack things. There were people who were trying to traffic you as a kid. And so this happens a lot to many different people online, and so that's where my story started. I was working in cybersecurity, and I was talking to parents all the time. I was doing lunch and learns. And so I started to realize that most people don't understand what it means and what it feels like to be a kid online, and a lot of people aren't talking about it. And so after a lot of tears and therapy, I decided to do this work today, and I do this 24/7 now. You mentioned that you were groomed online as a teen, and that's why this work exists and why you're so passionate about it. Can you walk us through what was going on at that time in your life? I had a really beautiful childhood, which is so hilarious because typically we have this conversation, people think you have to have a horrible childhood. My parents spoiled me to no end. Great parents. Because they were so focused on making sure they're the perfect parents, I did not feel connected to them. The online space was where I didn't have to be the perfect child, get all the great grades and all of that. I just wanted to just be myself. And I was also a really big bookworm. Loved books. And so from there, the online world felt like a book to me, a never-ending book where I could meet all of these different characters and learn about their lives. Mm-hmm. And so I was playing online games. I was on forums, I was on social media, and I just got to be who I was as a person. And because I was so young, I got online at 13, so I did not have the internet fully, like my own device until I was 13 years old. So my parents were like, "No TV, no real movies," except a couple of movies here and there. Very, very strict on that. And so I got it when they felt like I was mature enough to have it, and that is where everything began because I started talking to people that I shouldn't have been talking to. And so my parents were checking my phone. I would delete the apps. I would figure out how to hide the apps. I would... I had all these ways of being sneaky with it because I didn't feel like having the conversation with them, and I knew that if they were to know what was happening, even the things I didn't like- Like that made me feel uncomfortable. Someone asking me to do something or sending me a picture or trying to get me to do something else I didn't wanna do, I felt like they were gonna take away my devices. Which is why I always tell parents- Yeah if your kid feels like you're gonna take away their device, they're not gonna tell you things. They just, it's not gonna happen. Even though they did check-ins, they talked to me all the time, we have very close relations, but still I was like, "No. Never will tell them anything." I'm glad you mentioned that because I do think that there's a stereotype around kids who get groomed online must be just in situations in their family that they don't have great relationships with their parents. And so it sounds like that clearly wasn't the case in your situation. I didn't want people in my business. I was a very private kid, and I'm still like that as an adult. Right. I'm very open about many, many, many, many things, so most people wouldn't feel that way, which is why I got away with it as a kid, 'cause I was very open about a lot of things. The biggest thing was that I didn't feel comfortable telling them my inner world, and I felt like they would judge it 'cause they couldn't understand it, and that they would try to take it away 'cause I had just gotten access to it. They waited up until 13. All my friends were getting it at 8, 9, 10 years old, and I'm like, I had to get it at 13? So no way am I gonna do anything that makes it so that I don't have access to this device anymore. Right. And so that's really where it began. I was talking to somebody online and I developed feelings for them, and one of the biggest things that my mom told me was that never to talk to strangers online and never, ever talk to a guy online. Mm-hmm. And I developed feelings for him. He developed feelings for me. And so after a while he was saying, "Oh, like I want you to come visit me. I want you to come over to my house. Let's go to the park. Let's meet up." And so I had plans to go meet up with him. And in the back of my head I felt like I want my mom to know where I'm going. I was 16 at this point. Mm-hmm. I'm not asking for her permission. I have my provisional driver's license. I was feeling very grown. Yeah. Yeah. And- You're an adult basically right. I'm an adult. And so that's where it began. And so in that moment I felt, maybe let me just tell her where I'm going. I'm not asking for her permission, I'm just telling her I'm going. And I felt like she was gonna have a bad reaction, so I had already decided to move in with him. I had packed my bags, knocked on her door and I said, "Hey, I'm gonna go meet this guy. I'm just gonna let you know. I just wanted to let you know for safety." She did not have the reaction I thought. It actually ruined all of my plans. 'Cause I had texted him beforehand- Oh saying, "She's gonna freak out, and so get the car ready, I'm gonna be moving in today." And she didn't. She was just like, "Oh, okay. Like you like somebody..." She's like, "You know, we've all had crushes or people that we like." It felt like I was talking to a college friend. It felt like someone who cared about how I felt versus how she wanted me to be. Mm-hmm. And so from that five-minute conversation turned into a three-hour conversation. Mm-hmm. And I ended up feeling at that moment, I still wanted to meet him, but I thought, "I don't need to meet him tonight. I can sleep in my own bed. We're fine." Did you ever meet him? No, I did not actually end up meeting him. We did a FaceTime call, 'cause I remember one of the things she told me when in our conversation, she was like, "Do you even know what he looks like?" And I'm like, "Yeah." Yeah. "We sent pictures." And she was like, "No, you should probably do a FaceTime call." Yeah. Absolutely. Uh, but she didn't want me to talk to him, of course. But her giving that advice made me go, "Oh, okay." So I ended up doing a FaceTime call and I didn't like how I felt with him. And my conversation with her made me realize, "Oh, this is somebody..." When you present a challenging circumstance to someone that you love, this is how they should react. Mm-hmm. And I went back to our conversation. I had my conversation with him, and any time I presented a situation or a feeling that didn't match what he thought I should have, he had a bad reaction. Mm. Like, it was like a, a reaction of shame and blame and judgment. But my mother didn't. So I was like, "That feels more like love than how he's handling me." That was the first conversation I've ever had in my life with my mom where she accepted my online reality and trying to relate to it in any way that she could. And so that's what shifted in our relationship. It seems like she led with curiosity. When I talked to her today, she said that she knew that she lost me 'cause I'm hard-headed, and she knew that was our last conversation that we'd ever have if she reacted any other way. She genuinely felt like her whole world was falling apart and she failed as a parent and failed as a mom, and that my parents were getting a divorce at that time. And she really was like, "My whole world is ending and my child is leaving me." And so she didn't have that reaction because she felt like, "Oh, this is the best thing to do." It was more like, "Okay, everything I've done has failed, and I don't-- I have failed as a person, so let me just be there for her because let me just try to be her friend at this particular moment." Yeah. "Because I wanted a friend when I was her age, and so clearly she's searching for some safety and connection." So she was, like, in that mindset of like, "Okay, we're in crisis management mode at this particular moment." I, I think it's great also just to hear from a parent perspective on how quickly these things can happen and how much of it we might not be aware of. What does grooming actually look like, and why and how do parents miss it completely? Grooming happens with someone that your kid actually does know at school, after school programs, and they just contact them online to further that connection. So I would say red flags are really how kids are feeling in that moment. Like, that person should never make you feel uncomfortable. You should never be having these feelings in your stomach or a dark pit, or that the people that I love and appreciate or appreciate and love me, I can't tell them about the circumstance because they're gonna have a reaction. For me, when we're talking about red flags, it has to be a red flag for the child. The child has to understand it being a bad thing. We can't tell a kid that is a bad thing. So talking to a stranger online in the world that we live in, the age of AI, the age of social media, the age of online gaming, makes no sense. 'Cause everyone's a stranger. Right. Even if they think they know them, they're a stranger. Yeah. Okay, that's a great point. Question for you, because we obviously, we serve sports parents, and many of their athletes are online and maybe online earlier because they're trying to get recruited, and so they have to or feel like they need to have some sort of, like, public profile so that college coaches can find them. Um, and they're, you know, tagged in locations, and their school name and their club name is all out there, and their game schedules, like all of that is all searchable. So what do we do here? I always say, um, child ath- athletes, child actors, anyone who has to be in the public eye, they're on, they're It's a whole different ballgame because now you have to treat yourself and your family as public figures. So now it's about your child understanding what information do I not wanna put online so that they're not getting more information about me and my family? Unless something needs to be public, then you keep it private as much as humanly possible. And if it needs to be public, I understand. I'm not against kids having public profiles. I know a lot of people are. I go back, and it's, it's a very nuanced subject. I have to do a whole in-depth series on what I believe about it. I think for as much as possible, you want as little of them online as possible. However, they still have dreams and goals and aspirations, and I never want them to believe predators and hackers are in control of their life and their destiny. Mm-hmm. So because I've been through online grooming, I find it very challenging to tell a child, "You can't follow your hopes and dreams because there's a boogeyman out there." Like- Right. Yeah we're not doing that. We can say, "There are boogeymen out there, so while you follow your hopes and dreams, here are the things that we're not going to put online. How can we help your career without hindering your safety?" Do you have some general guidelines for parents for their athletes if they are gonna be online, what settings or, I don't know, just some general guardrails on the best practices when it comes to having adolescents online? I always say this, best settings are internal, and I know that no one wants to hear that. Yeah. But externally, I would say, okay, so you're gonna have to post when they're on the field, and we may be able to see like what, where they're exactly playing. Don't make it easy for someone. Before you post it online, ask yourself, "Is this helping my child's dream? And is this, is this going to hinder their safety online? And is, is there a way to meet in the middle?" Where I'm not gonna take a picture of them in the car in front of our house, or every time they win, we go to this particular restaurant. Oh, so now I know when you win the game, I can find you there. Okay. So these are the type of things you wanna think about. Yeah. Okay. That's helpful. Uh, 'cause there's really kind of two things that are going through my head right now. There's the, like, real considerations when it comes to online safety and potential for predators, manipulation, grooming, things like that, and then there's this conversation that those of us that have read Jonathan Haidt's book around anxious generation and what this is doing to our kids in terms of their confidence and how they view themselves. So we know that, and we work primarily with girl athletes, that they're building their identity and confidence partly through a phone screen, like comparisons, DMs, likes. And so how do you think that this online presence that they are thrust into changes what confidence even means for this generation? What girls go through, the misogyny, the sexism, the comparisons, this is not new, so we can like, "Okay, we're not the first ones to go through this." Magazines existed, TV shows, and series, and, um, you know, celebrity gossip websites, and, you know, whatever. We-- This has, this has been here for, for a very long time, so that's just number one. Mm-hmm. Number two, the reason why it's so big is because it's everywhere and it's all the time and it's in our face, and we're not meant to be seeing it that much. So I would say, besides what we all know is, go touch grass and walk in the park, and tr- you know, ride your bike. I think that's beautiful. I love that. However, your kids are still gonna be online. Mm-hmm. So for me, I believe in giving kids the power and empowering them to curate their online experiences. If I'm looking at somebody and they're triggering me, I can decide not to follow them. I can follow people that make me feel good about myself in whatever way that is. When I talk to teens, I say, "There's doom scrolling." We've all heard of doom, doom scrolling. There's also something called dream scrolling. Hmm. So let's build your dream feed. Instead of doom scrolling, most of the kids are like, "Well, I wanna feel good." So I'm thinking, okay, let's write down or think about all the things that make you feel good. Mm-hmm. When you look at your TikTok feed or your Instagram feed or your YouTube feed or Snapchat, are they represented there? And I haven't read The Anxious Generation yet, but I, I follow him and I see his posts. He definitely has, and that's why I'm curious about you, too, if you have a stance. He has this wait till eight for a phone. Um, but then, like, at that, it's not even an iPhone or anything, it's just, like, a communication device. And then wait until 18 for social media. And, I mean, I coach high school volleyball, so I'm with teens, like, every single day. We have teens, high school athletes in our program, and, like, they literally all have social media. Once you give it, I don't really think you can... I mean, yes, you're the parent, but taking it away seems like not really an option. I would even push back to say even, and you said this in the beginning of the podcast, which I loved, even if you don't give it, they're still on it. So there's a, there's a spectrum, right? Mm-hmm. They're either still on it because their friends are on it, so they're exposed to what their friends are exposed to, or they don't even see it, but their friends are talking about what they see on social media, are impacted by it, and so their conversations are now shifting because of what they see in their feed, so your child is still impacted by it. I do believe waiting as long as you can possibly wait, but I don't want any parent who waits, 'cause I get this all the time, everyone who, like... I talk to people, obviously I talk, I do this 24/7, so I talk to people all the time. And they're like, "I wanna protect my kids from online predators." And they're 16 years old. "And I said I was gonna wait until 18, but they're really begging for it, and I decided, you know what? I'll give them one more year right before college, I'll give it them the device." And then I check in with them, and then they would tell me, "Oh, I just found out my kid had social media for the last couple of years." And it happens all the time. Yeah. And so they're realizing, "Oh my God, my kid has been shaped by this feed that I didn't even know existed 'cause I was thinking I was waiting." So my biggest challenge with waiting is that we're acting like kids are not impacted by that before. Mm-hmm. So I'm in the, the, the belief system that you still have to learn how to protect your kids from online predators, and threats, and AI, and all of that before they're on social media. And then also, you don't want to wait until 18, because now they're off to college, and who's teaching them how to stay safe on social media? Now, now they're 18- And they're gone. Most likely they're gone, they're off to college. And so now- Yeah their sha- their ideas of how to stay safe online is sh- are shaped by the other college students who didn't have to wait, and now they're the kid in the candy shop. I believe 16, generally, that's the best time to wait, up until. Because- Yeah that gives you a couple of years until college. But it really does depend on the child. It depends on their needs, why they need social media. Um, there's, there's a plethora of reasons why it might be at 13 that you give them the phone or social media. Yeah. Okay. That's great. It does remind me, I taught high school health for years, and this was always the conversation around sex education. You know, so like, "They don't need to know, you know, 'cause they're not sexually active." And I'm like, "Well, okay, so if w- Yeah first of all, maybe not. But also we need to protect them before they get into situations where they're gonna need the skills. So, yeah. You get it. You overly get it. You overstand. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Okay. That's great. And so when you say we need to educate them before they're in those situations, what are your top tips for education? Any, like, quick hits that parents can be making sure they're covering with their kids? Well, I mean, after I w- what I went through online and after working in corporate, I developed this, this method of protecting kids online. It's called the SAFE method. So safe spaces, accountability, fun, and empathy. And so number one is you're providing a safe space for your child. It's very, very deep, so this is just a quick high level. Safe space is for your child to be able to talk to you about anything and everything, including things like they had to go through with the health education classes, all that. The second portion is accountability. So if you say that you're not gonna be mad at something, that you're not mad, and then when you are mad because you're a human being, you apologize and you say, "Hey, I'm so sorry. I really want you to feel comfortable coming to me." The third one is fun with your child, so you're engaging in their love of the internet, whether it's games, social media, you know, athletic, whatever. It doesn't really matter, online or offline. But if you wanna protect your kids online, you really have to go deep into the online space, however you can possibly do it. It doesn't have to be play the game with them, but if they're talking about Roblox for the 100th time that week, you know, you can roll your eyes internally, but lock in. Yeah. And then E is, uh, is empathy, so that's the fourth one. So you're sh- putting yourself in your child's shoes, understanding their world. Those are the four quick, high-level things you need to do to protect your kids online. After that, then you can decide, oh, I'm putting a parental monitoring app. Oh, do, I'm, I'm doing parental controls. Oh, I'm gonna change my settings. Because I believe no matter what setting you change or what parental controls you have, it's not gonna matter if you don't have those other four things set up. So that's quickly what you can do to keep your kids safe. Okay, love that. So you posted recently on your social media, and I love this, you talked about this with your own mom, but if your child is afraid of your reaction, they're easier for a predator to control. So say a mom is curious about what's going on or like, "Okay, now I wanna monitor," but the whole, "Hey, just show me your phone" just causes a kid to shut down or Tips on how to have that conversation if a mom is like, "I feel like I want to chat with my daughter about this." I would say, one, if you wanna see your child's phone, you, I mean, you pay for the bill, that's your child and you're trying to protect them. So I'm not against seeing your child's ph- I, I'm just not against it. Yeah. However, I believe that that should be an expectation that they understand in the beginning that- Mm-hmm there will be phone check-ins. And if they don't understand in the beginning, then you can, you- there's a, there's very nuanced way to approach it later. I'd... It's too much to get into now, but you have to- Yeah approach it a very nuanced way if you're gonna do it later on. Ideally, you tell them, "Hey, this is my phone. I'm paying the bills. I'm your parent. I'm responsible for you. I'll be checking the phone every now and then. If you have any questions about it, let's talk about it. This is what I'll be doing." Secondly, you approach your kid in a curious manner and trying to understand their world. Mm-hmm. And maybe sometimes the best way to approach the conversation is not to approach it directly, is to do it indirectly. If your child is in a danger and you need to pull 'em off the train tracks, you do whatever you need to do to pull 'em off the train tracks. So much of this is just like parenting. Honestly, everything that you're doing to give your child a beautiful, happy, healthy life, to raise really independent, elite competitor kids- Yeah that is what helps them stay safe online. So you have everything you need. There may be certain things you'd understand with, you know, cybersecurity, threat intelligence, AI, parental controls, monitoring, settings, tech. Oh my God. I understand that. Yeah. But every single thing that you're developing within yourself to be better for yourself, to be better for the people in your life, to be better for your kids, to give your kids the best life possible, is protecting them online. So do not beat yourself up. The fact that you're listening to this podcast, the fact that you listen to the podcast in general, all, every, all of the beautiful things you're learning here to make sure that you're raising amazing elite competitor kids, that's gonna protect them online. Yeah. Exactly. Congratulations. You're doing what you're supposed to be doing. Yes. I love that. Okay. Well, I have one, one more question before we kinda wrap it up. When we're talking about, like, AI chatbots and fake accounts and, like, all this other stuff, what's kinda like the newest threat parents maybe haven't even heard of? Are there things surfacing that we don't know about that you do? This is what I would say. I'm gonna go back to the SAFE method. Okay. It's everything. Mm-hmm. Everything is being empowered now with AI. So similar to how tech companies are being empowered with AI, predators are being empowered with AI. They can find your kids easier, quicker, faster, more personalized without ever having to know your kids. 300 million children in one year who are impacted by online abuse and exploitation. So I would say that AI is speeding everything up now, and so you really can't act like that no one's gonna be finding your kids because, yes, they are, which is why you always focus on what you can control, which is the SAFE method. Safe spaces, accountability, fun, empathy. That is the biggest domino that knocks over all the other dominoes. So if you really wanna protect your kids from all the darkness, you have to be the light. This has been really great. Um, Farideh, can you tell us where parents can find you? A little bit about how you work with parents. So I'm on all the platforms you are on, so you can find me @cyberfarideh, and you'll see it's C-Y-B-E-R F-A-R-E-E-D-A-H And it's also cyberfarida.com. Once you go there, you can message me if you wanna work together. I work with anybody and everybody that is aligned to my mission. I also have my Protect Kids Online membership, where we focus specifically on protecting tweens and teens from online predators and threats in the age of AI. And also, I have my free Protect Kids Online resource library, where I go into-- I give you a bunch of resources to help you keep your kids safe in this crazy world. So we go into things like screen time and protecting your kids from online, in online games and social media, and so there's tons of resources for you there. We will link those in the description below. But thank you again, Farida, for coming in and sharing so generously with us. Thank you.